Ruth Davidson 9pm - 10pm
Shelagh Fogarty's heated clash with pro-herd immunity caller
20 October 2020, 16:59
This is the moment a caller clashed with LBC's Shelagh Fogarty on the subject of herd immunity while discussing Sweden's handling of the Covid crisis.
The disagreement between Shelagh and Rob from Teddington has come after Welsh First Minister this week announced Wales is set to enter a "fire break" lockdown to reduce the nation's rising number of Covid cases.
Meanwhile, the Government is set to impose the highest tier of Covid restrictions (Tier Three) on Greater Manchester after talks it had with local leaders over financial support for the city broke down.
Rob argued the reason Sweden is "in a better position" than the UK is "because they've got herd immunity" and have "followed the right strategy".
He also said: "The point is, in Sweden the rules are completely different. They're all standing next to each other on trains, they're all in pubs right next to each other, they're not wearing masks."
However Shelagh responded to Rob's point by saying that Sweden "haven't got herd immunity".
Speaking more broadly about Sweden's handling of the Covid crisis, Shelagh also told the caller: "They have better support for people who isolate than we do."
But Rob continued to insist that the UK should strive to "create herd immunity" as it continues to face the coronavirus crisis.
He said: "We wouldn't need to put Wales and Manchester in lockdown if we did what we're supposed to do...and create herd immunity. This is a coronavirus that we can't get rid of."
Immediately after the exchange between the pair ended, Shelagh said: "You don't create herd immunity by giving people a full on disease and killing many thousands in the process. You don't create herd immunity that way.
"The notion of herd immunity is built into the huge global success story that is vaccination. You don't give people diseases willy-nilly [and] randomly in order to make them sick."